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Sparkle - 2015.

Spider's now Cherry Red and has a new owner, Tom, who is also at Whitefriars Sailing club.

Yes, I think I have read some info on it, but not the article itself.
Its a dream only at this point - real life gets in the way.  And I already have 3 N12's. 
But you never know, stranger things have happened.
I do prefer the 'glued clinker' variety though, much cleaner inside and easier to look after.
Just eyeing up 'Planet' for a refurb though.  Once Sparkle is back on the water, and some remedial work is done on Spider.
Cheers
Steve

All,
It is my dream to one day build my own boat.  However I am a little stuck in the past.  If it were going to be a N12, it would have to be a glued clinker design from the late 50's to late 1960's, much like the Starfish I currently own (Sparkle 2383) which I have re-decked this winter.
Can you still get hold of the plans for these boats?  Squids, Sparklets, Starfish, late Proctor designs, etc.
Someday I will win the lottery.
And this must be done before I am too old to sail it.
Cheers
Steve

New gunnels and 3 coats of G4 pond sealer.  A week or two to let hrden off before I 'wet & dry' her before a final couple of coats of traditional varnish.

Sparkle is currently being re-decked.

Both my classics have come rigged for single handing. Both Sparkle and Spider.  No idea if they were raced like that, but I am often out in light conditions on my own.

Interesting to note that a very strong portion of them are what I would regard as later (No's above 3100) designs, followed by a handful of late 4 plankers.  Only a couple of vintage boats in there.
Some of them look excellent value, if you are a whippet with an even lighter junior crew.
Has the class designed itself into a corner over the last 30 years?  Shallow cockpit, complexity, low boom and little room for the crew up front.
Comment from an older, slightly fat, clinker/early 4 planker owner.
But more to the point is the maintenance, if I had a penny for everyone at my club who has 'gone to plastic' for an easier life, I would be a rich man...Or at least I could buy myself a beer.
Still, it is the end of the season.
Cheers

I have cherry picked some recent chat about Spider from the CVRDA:
" You seem to have acquired a very well known 12 in it's day. Think it was built in 1971 to a design by Dave East and did very well at the following Burton Week, placing in the burton cup and winning the Coronation cup crewed by him and his wife Ricky? Think it moved up to Scotland and was owned by Lady Anne Coventry. Illustrated twice in the Nat 12 handbook and used to illustrate the A12 in sailing dinghys of the world 1974/5 ish.  Interesting boat and well worth a bit of elbow grease to keep her going"
"Spider came 6th in the Silver National Cup in 1971 ?"
It would be nice to confirm the above - anyone?
This other bit of info is also very interesting on a personal note.
" I am very friendly with the second owner of Spider who has been very helpful to me in providing shelter for my boats and a place to work although he did suggest once that perhaps I should sell a boat before I bought any more and that was just my 4th boat! Anyway I brought this thread to his attention and this is the email he sent me in reply.
Thanks for that, Angus. I normally avoid social media like the plague, and have not a clue how to reply. You can forward this e-mail if you like.
Mike. 
"I bought Spider from David East after Burton Week at Scarborough. She is a variation of the Whisper design and I think there was one other one built.   She probably did more for my sailing than any other boat I have sailed.   David said she would not point as high as other boats of the time, so that helped me to kick the pinching habit.  At some point in any race she would produce a burst of speed that would take you past the opposition.  Fiona and I were almost unbeatable until Hugh Macintyre bought a Dart.  She was originally painted dark blue with a two pack polyeuretyhane paint which was starting to crack.   I stripped her down to the wood, melting the glass joints in the process, so i had to replace all the exterior taped joints.  I painted her green, a brighter version of what she is now. We bought a Paper Dart in 75 and I sold Spider to someone in the club, but I do not know where she went after that.  She looks in remarkably good shape.
Mike
This probably does not add much to the history but I know Mike thougt highly of this boat as it is the one he talks about most although he owned several 12s after her including a couple of design 8s. He now sails flying 15s and is still diffcult to beat. Fiona is his wife."
Angus"
Spider's previous owner, Sami, who had started to refresh her, had to give her up after the loss of her workshop space.  I will continue to get her back sailing, in the same vein.  This will only be a refresh and not a full strip and rebuild - i.e. making good locally, fresh coat of paint and varnish only where required.  She has a couple of 'war wounds', there is no doubt, but nothing that will detract from her function - she is in generally solid condition. 
The deck is in generally good condition, with no splitting or anything, although I have put in a couple of small veneer sections, where a skim of filler  was evident. I do not like seeing filler, and prefer to see wood, even if it is a different colour from its surroundings deck.  The colour of the deck generally, is faded, but the previous owner and I agree, did not want to try and sand away the faded top layer and risk taking breaking through the top veneer.  The deck and certain other parts of the boat have been painted at some point, but the paint has been stripped back - 99% successfully.  So presentable, but not perfect.
Spider now has a painted gloss white hull, thanks to Sami.
The floor (garboards) have some minor cracks in the top veneer will be stabilished and then a fresh coat of floor paint.  No stripping back is necessary and there appears to be no rot.  Caught just in time.  The sides inboard just need a jolly good clean and, perhaps a coat of varnish. 
Spider will be recovered more in accordance with the CVRDA ethos, i.e. I will be fixing what needs to be fixed, using the historic equipment/fittings that came with the boat, rather than upgrading or modernising.  Wheeled kicker with metal triangle thingy? Original mast and boom, cleats, etc. 
Cheers

Spider is still about, I am picking her up this afternoon from her previous owner.  She is in the middle of a quick paint and varnishing, a stopgap, rather than a full strip/rebuild, just to keep her going in the short to medium term, but should be back on the water by the end of the month, hopefully.  Pictures to follow.  She will be sailed in and around the Cotswold Water Park (Whitefriars SC).  I will get a picture up in due course.

I read the previous thread with great interest.  As already alluded to, I prefer the simpler older clinker or single skin designs, as a 'classic nut'.  I make no apologies for that.  And as a result some might think that I have little to add to this thread. But as one thread dies another starts....
My preference is for a simple boat with some cockpit depth and a higher boom, better weight carrying ability and room in the front for the crew, tin rig, simple controls, no more than sheets, kicker, outhaul and down haul, to be sailed predominantly inland, but able to cope in larger waters. I do not want anything hard chined - nothing pretty about corners.   That puts me back in the 60s and early 70s. 
So if £10,000 were to fall into my lap to spend on a new boat, I would actually be looking for a 'new classic'.  Not quite 'Gruffalo', a much newer design (!!!?).  But we are still talking either one of the last glued clinkers or perhaps a 4 planker, if not too shallow hull. I am sure a 4 planker would be cheaper to have built than a clinker.  But I am dreaming....
Anyone likely to be making a 'new classic' and to what design?   Perhaps a different thread might be in order - sorry...

Why not put a generic 'official letter' or explanatory document on the website, for owners to download and present to their clubs.  With a bit more detail about RYA policy and pertinant references, etc.  This could be presented in such a way to 'blow out the water' any of the usual arguments for not doing anything.....
Cheers

One thing the N12 has got, is a very rich history, with many designs from many different eras.  Along side the modern sharp end of sailing, the class should continue promote and possibly expand the support for the racing of older designs.  Perhaps sharing venues with the CVRDA (Classic and Vintage Racing Dinghy Association) like the Merlin Rockets occasionally do.  I understand there is a renewed interest in 4 plankers which is a step in the right direction as long as they are raced with the age appropriate gear.  I understand this is well in hand.  These older designs still have much to offer and interest in them can only steady the price of those more recent designs.
Steve H

I love my National 12 (s).  I have gravitated towards a classic N12, because my tall rig, classic Merlin Rocket was a bit of a handful on the sort of lakes I generally sail on, when the wind gets up.  Its a two adult boat, that I was often spilling the wind just to keep her upright, even with another like sized person on board.  The 'lake' wants you to commit youself 100%, just to suprise you with a sudden fluke, direction change or hole - then your in.  The N12 is just that bit more manageable with a light crew.  However, I am not competive, really.  Which is just as well.  I have not seen 12 stone for 25 years or more, and unlikley to do so unless I lop a leg off.  My 'ideal weight for height' is above that.  And I am only 5' 10".  Which means my crew has to be very light to stand any chance.
My questions, above are about finding out.  I am not trying to 'stir the pot'.  But it has to be said that a new N12 would not be on the cards for me, even if I had 12 grand and the permission from the boss to spend it.  Not only am I too fat, but I am, fankly, not a good enough sailor to justify it.
So my vote is for the ye olde glued clinker of the 60's, and I will not be troubling any one at the front.
Did I mention I have a fetish for wood......
regards
Steve Hawkins

So does the class need a simplified 'weight carrier' (and I mean 23 stone and above) with all round sailing ability, i.e. goes as well upwind as downwind for inland waters then?
Or will nobody buy it, even if it existed......
Cheers
Steve