What is a sail batten?

rick perkins · 21 Feb 2007, 01:24

Tim L (Guest) · 21 Feb 2007, 06:25

Jon_P · 21 Feb 2007, 07:41

Yep in ACC the batten must remain set throughout the race and cannot be adjusted. They also have to obey the same limitations of width etc that normal battens do.

Jon

Lukepiewalker · 21 Feb 2007, 07:49

Presumably on the AC boats it is also easier to replace and less damaging than a broken carbon one...

rick perkins · 21 Feb 2007, 09:04

ACC boats use inflatable battens because overlapping headsails are faster but the battens get broken during manouvers ... so that is their reason ...

The only reason for doing this with a N12 is to get a nice fully battened main with a nice head profile that is legal ... perhaps

JohnMurrell · 21 Feb 2007, 09:09

Ah! Rick - you must have deep pockets!!!!!

I had a similar problem but just built 2 boats in a year and 'her in doors said 'nough!

rick perkins · 21 Feb 2007, 09:17

[quote by=John_Murrell link=Blah.cgi?b=Cool1,m=1171995144,s=20 date=1172092163]Ah! Rick - you must have deep pockets!!!!![/quote]

I don't see this has to be expensive ... build pockets into the sail that are tapered and insert inner tubes from bikes that are cut into tubes with the ends sealed.

Bit of experimentation to get the pocket profiles right but but apart from that seems OK...

Depends if people will shut this door before it gets opened I suppose ...

Tim L (Guest) · 22 Feb 2007, 12:48

Trying to envision it in my head but tend to think that inflatable battens might not prove stiff enough to support any significant roach on the main.

The roaches they support on ACC jibs are pretty small with a lot of batten contained in the 'stable' part of the sail - not sure that you'd be able to get enough pressure to support the top of a main, think they'd probably go floppy (and you don't want that...)

rick perkins · 22 Feb 2007, 08:43

[quote by=Tim L (Guest) link=Blah.cgi?b=Cool1,m=1171995144,s=22 date=1172105316]Trying to envision it in my head but tend to think that inflatable battens might not prove stiff enough to support any significant roach on the main.

The roaches they support on ACC jibs are pretty small with a lot of batten contained in the 'stable' part of the sail - not sure that you'd be able to get enough pressure to support the top of a main, think they'd probably go floppy (and you don't want that...)

[/quote]

You could be right - only experimentation will tell ...

John Meadowcroft · 23 Feb 2007, 08:19

Like Tim it is getting the requieste amount of batten stiffness that I cannot get my head round - that is why I suggested pneumatic equipment earlier. I dont think that there would be enough pressure in the innertube, and I think that you would want a sausage tube rather than an innertube.

Too right though, the only way to find out is to have a go.

As a final thought the measurer would probably want to measure the sail in its sailing condition - this is how masts are measured so as to avoid getting them up to weight by having lead attached to the halyard. Under such circumstances how do you get around 11.8.1 - allowing the sale to be folded flat without permanent damage.

rick perkins · 23 Feb 2007, 08:45

Which rule requires the pocket be inflated?

And if it were to be inflated which rule would specify the PSI?

The PSI in the pocket would make a lot of difference to the stiffness ...

11.8.1 would be fine if the pocket was not inflated or lightly inflated and I can't see any requirement that any pocket should be inflated ...

JimC · 23 Feb 2007, 09:00

[quote by=rick_perkins link=Blah.cgi?b=Cool1,m=1171995144,s=13 date=1172063300]
it seems to me that inflatable battens are uncontrolled and you could have as many as you like of any length ...[/quote]

I'm neither an N12 sailor or an RYA measurer, but I would have thought the duck principle comes into place: if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, swims like a duck, quacks like a duck etc, then its a duck.
Seems to me that your batten material is unrestricted then anything that acts as a batten is subject to your batten rules.

rick perkins · 23 Feb 2007, 09:21

[quote by=JimC link=Blah.cgi?b=Cool1,m=1171995144,s=26 date=1172221200]

I'm neither an N12 sailor or an RYA measurer, but I would have thought the duck principle comes into place: if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, swims like a duck, quacks like a duck etc, then its a duck.
Seems to me that your batten material is unrestricted then anything that acts as a batten is subject to your batten rules.

[/quote]

Quite right ... a batten is a long thin bendy stick, usually rectangular in section & blue ... air is well air ...

Not similar at all ...

JimC · 24 Feb 2007, 11:36

[quote by=rick_perkins link=Blah.cgi?b=Cool1,m=1171995144,s=27 date=1172222518]Not similar at all ...[/quote]
Function my boy, function.

rick perkins · 24 Feb 2007, 11:54

[quote by=JimC link=Blah.cgi?b=Cool1,m=1171995144,s=28 date=1172316996]
Function my boy, function.

[/quote]

I guess it is down to how the rules are enforced ... I have asked the mesasurer so we'll see what the outcome is ...