Thwart Position

[chalky]

Can anyone advise on how far the back edge of the thwart in a Baggy T should be from the transom? N3434 would appear to have had a thwart added at some point in her life and it appears to me to be too far aft.
I have three options:

• leave it where it is. quick and easy
• move it forward . time consuming and I want to go racing
• take it out . Any potential problems?

Picture N3434 and N760 being swapped around in the drive.....
 

[johnk]

The thwart does provide valuable bracing for the centreboard case, stopping the top from moving side to side. I would only remove it if you are SURE that the rest of the boat is strong enough. Others should be able to give more accurate advice.
As for the fore and aft position of the thwart, give the present position a try. The underwater shapes of 3434 and 760 will be very different.

[chalky]

I sailed the boat a couple of times at the end of last year and the thwart was stopping me moving forward easily to stop the transom dragging. Is this a Baggy trait? I haven't sailed N760 yet, the rebuild not quite finished and waiting for new sails.
Not a very good picture of the transoms but the differing shapes are clear enough.

[MikeDay]

It looks fine to me.  The relative positions of the thwarts on two such different designs is immaterial.  There are two risks of moving it forward - you restrict the crew's working area and you put the crew's weight too far forward for when the wind gets up and you don't want the boat nose-diving downwind.  Most people who have had thwart-less boats end up adding them - otherwise their crews refuse to sail as it's very uncomfortable.  It's also difficult to get the toe-straps to stand up without a thwart.  And you could end up with removing a key part of the stiffness of the boat.  You only need to get forward of the thwart in very light airs, when you should be close to the shroud on the beat and the run.  For this to work, you need a long enough tiller extension and main sheet.  You just get used to slipping behind the thwart when you tack and gybe.  So leave it where it is and just practice on helm and crew moving around to suit the conditions - we all do it.

Mike D
N353*

[intheboatshed]

Looks about right to me as well - if anything, it's actually further forward than on my Baggy.
I've only sailed mine a couple of times as well, but I've also noticed that you have to keep your weight well forward to stop the transom dragging (or in my case stop her taking on water through the transom flaps). But as I've never sailed a 12 before I cannot say whether this is unique to Baggies, or a trait of the newer 12s. 
Tim

[JohnMurrell]

From memory the thwart has always been there. I don't have many pictures of 3434 from her Saltash days but those I have indicate a crew sitting comfortably forward and in the boat - bum cheeks would definately hurt if it was only the perches! Also as has already been said, the construction of this hull would mean it would have creaked badly if there wasn't any central bracing............................
I remember praying at the time she was being built that they would register her before I registered the Foolish that I was just finishing as my first 'real' Twelve was a Mr Jones N2425 so I really wanted to have 3435!

[GarryR]

Talking of boat numbers I have a nice picture of me sailing Merlin 111 being crossed by Merlin No 1222 - exactly 1111 boats after mine!!

[Chadders]

Yesterday Neil McInnes wrote-
Not into these forum things, but based on the original baggys, like mine, N3434’S thwart is much further forward.
 
The only photo of mine I can easily turn up sort of shows it has the thwart at the aft frame. I then sail at the thwart and forward of it until the crew is sitting up / out.
 
If you are bored, could you please add a response for me, no worries if not.
Not bored Neil but here it is anyway!  Howard C aka Chadders